Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Vulgar
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by Vulgar »

People don't wanna give Jay the Goat title cause he's a billionaire. Who's also married to a legend whos worth almost a billy herself. The man has an exhibit in the Brooklyn library showcasing his career. And he's still alive. None of these other "goats" are in the song writers HOF. Let's knock it off in here.
Big Moose
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by Big Moose »

what makes the song writer's hall of fame less bullshit than the grammy's or any other award?

Jay isn't THAT amazing of a song writer in the grand scheme

50 Cent is a better song writer I could argue. or was in his prime.

Jay actually really is great at his best as well.

But its not like his greatest strengths have traditionally been story telling or a crazy hook game. again he's good at those things. he's good at most everything.

He's also always been a safe pick for everybody in terms of rap GOAT. A very inoffensive choice all around.

I just think some people over estimate his influence and the ubiquity of his music tho. Especially outside of NY and bigger cities on the east coast. Internationally I'd imagine Ja Rule was doing better numbers than Jay. DMX too. I dunno for sure, but I'd assume so.

50's wave was way bigger. So was wayne's. So is Drake's. Em's obviously way bigger. Cole and Kendrick are similar to Jay's wave before Beyonce. and that's not me holding her against Jay, it's just acknowledging that their marriage amplified both of their levels of fame and notoriety. But that doesn't interest me. It's mostly tabloid fodder.
Big Moose
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by Big Moose »

cody wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 2:58 pm

Twista said something really dope about rappers

It’s progressive and I agree
traditional lyricists/old school mentality rappers and new age ghost writer/A.I. loving auto tune crooners and what not can coexist

there are enough listeners to go around.

That said, of course ghost writers or even open collaboration with writing raises your ceiling. It makes everything easier.

And i can see why someone wants to hear what happens when you use those tools.

But i can also see why people like myself prefer the traditional style as they see it as more pure, authentic, and admirable/impressive.

And the funny thing is, while ghost writers and collaborative writing have resulted in massive hit kings like Drake and Kanye and can dominate that aspect of rap and music

They have never been able and I believe will never be able to use that process to outrap or out write the lyrical/technical types like Nas/Em/Black Thought etc and beat them at their own game. I don't think adding A.I. to the tool set is going to change that either. The singular artist/author will always have its place and value imo.
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xcalibur
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by xcalibur »

Without a doubt, Biggie & 2pac had a substantial impact on hip-hop, contributing alot to its DNA. They also had mass appeal, but those two factors should be distinguished. You can have both mass appeal & impact, or one or the other. Artists like 50 cent & Eminem were massive, but their contributions to rap DNA are limited by comparison. At the other end, Grand Wizard Theodore was one of the pioneers of rap, it wouldn't be the same genre without him, and while he's obviously not obscure, he is relatively unknown to the casual listener.

But there are other factors to consider, like staying power and longevity. I'll be in a parking lot and hear someone blasting "going going, back back, to cali cali" to this day, while alot of BIGs contemporaries have been out of rotation for years. Awhile back, ppl were trolling me for drawing a comparison between Madonna and Busta Rhymes -- to clarify, they're definitely not the same, but there is a common thread: the ability to adapt & stay relevant over the long-term, surfing on different trends.

Jay-Z has plenty of mass appeal, some impact (although not as much as Biggie or 2pac), but what he's got most of all is consistent output. Lots of quality, platinum albums, blockbuster singles, holdin it down from late 90s, through the 00s, and beyond, and an undeniable classic in Reasonable Doubt. He's not really the best in any one category, but he's well above average all around, and stayed that way longer than most. He's kinda like a latter-day version of Big Daddy Kane in that regard.

I can't say Jay-Z is GOAT, but he's definitely a runner-up.
Big Moose
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by Big Moose »

I could argue the impact on rap dna point

Em largely popularized battle rap. Would the scene be recognizable today if 8 mile never happened?

Kendrick basically remade the song Kim on his last album. He and Cole both list Em as a top influence. Even Drake made an ode to Superman. Joyner was influenced. Even Tory Lanez

Tyler and Earl Sweatshirt were massively influenced

Cordae and Juice WRLD made a role model remix. Juice freestyled for an hour on Em beats

I could list a lot more rappers accused of biting or being Em clones than Jay or big clones

Hopsin, Token, NF, Asher, Tom MacDonald, Dax etc


I don’t even like the battle scene or some of the rappers listed, but they exist
As Seen On Tv
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Re: Jay-Z finally has the balls to say something in public in front of his peers

Post by As Seen On Tv »

Big Homey Urb wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 4:37 pm
cody wrote:
Big Homey Urb wrote: Wed Feb 07, 2024 9:54 pm Her last album was mid

I get what Jay is trying to say, but Beyoncé 40 years old and he 50 somethin - they had they run, it’s over with.


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Because of age and the change of culture

Jay is involved with the nfl and ownership stuff, he did everything he could have done for music.

Their reign is on to bigger things than dropping hit songs which they done for many decades

the problem is, there are no super stars anymore - it skipped a generation. so we are clinging on to the ones we have

however i believe there is a dawning of a new age in music right now. there is something brewing
I agree and I think it’s because ppl like Jay and Beyoncé won’t give up their stronghold. But it’ll all come crashing down soon


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